The Constitution is a living document. It was written to be changed, updated and amended. Making sure the Constitution and democracy is still working in 2076 is the goal of the organization Democracy 2076. Listen to Cecili Wake discuss the future of democracy.
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Transcription
00:00:00:01 – 00:00:02:46
David Martin
This is the good government show.
00:00:02:50 – 00:00:28:08
Cecili Wake
Anything that lasts a long time. If you think about the Constitution as a machine. Anything that lasts a long time needs to be fixed along the way. And that means if we fix it along the way, we can keep that for the long term. And I think that that’s the really the thing to remember is if we keep it up to date, if we provide the changes that are needed, given where we are in our reality in time, then it can live much longer.
00:00:28:08 – 00:00:48:08
Cecili Wake
But if we don’t make those changes and it becomes rigid, it’s much more likely to break. And I think the real key here is that we need a positive vision for the future. We need to say this is what it could be. And here’s a way of getting there. If we want to have a democracy. We have to do democracy.
00:00:48:13 – 00:01:03:09
Cecili Wake
And what that means is we have to be able to disagree with each other and still come to the table and identify solutions together. One of the challenges that we experience is that most Americans take the status quo for granted.
00:01:03:14 – 00:01:24:58
David Martin
Thomas Jefferson thought the Constitution should be rewritten every generation. While there’s very little chance we’re going to completely rewrite the Constitution. One organization is working to make sure it continues to be a living and relevant document, and it continues to serve the people. Welcome to the Good Government show. I’m Dave Martin. First, help us show the message of good government by liking us and sharing us where we are on social media.
00:01:25:03 – 00:01:49:58
David Martin
Make sure to give us and send our show everywhere. We all need to talk about good government. Cecily wake is the deputy director of democracy 2076. The mission is to make sure the Constitution and American democracy is as strong in 2076. The tricentennial, as it was when it was written after American independence in 1776. I met Cecily at the National Academy of Public Ministrations Annual Conference in Washington.
00:01:50:02 – 00:02:09:19
David Martin
She was a panelist on a session called Reimagining Government. 2076 is thinking about what government will look like in 50 years, and how government might change to make sure it continues to deliver the democracy we all want. And no small feat when you consider that the last amendment was in 1971, and that change lowered the voting aged 18.
00:02:09:31 – 00:02:32:01
David Martin
You realize it might be time to update the Constitution. Sure, change can be frightening, but doing nothing is scary too. And we talk about movies and their impact on our thoughts on democracy. And she is a fan of The West Wing. So coming up, some thoughts on the future of democracy where the Constitution might be headed and how we can ensure our democracy makes it to its 300th birthday.
00:02:32:05 – 00:02:42:41
David Martin
That’s next with Cecily Wake of Democracy 2076.
00:02:42:46 – 00:03:09:21
David Martin
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00:03:09:33 – 00:03:33:54
David Martin
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00:03:33:59 – 00:03:43:31
David Martin
Let Hello Nation lift you up and lead the conversation. Visit. Hello nation.com to learn more.
00:03:43:36 – 00:04:05:17
David Martin
Once you wrap up this episode of The Good Government Show, give a listen to our friends over at Good News for lefties. This daily podcast highlights news stories that show there’s more good news out there. Other people in government are really trying to do the right thing. That’s good news for lefties. Listen, we’re listening now.
00:04:05:21 – 00:04:25:05
David Martin
Welcome to the Good Government show. I’m happy to have with me Cecily Waite. She is the deputy director of an organization called democracy 2076. We are here at the National Academy of Public Administration at their national conference where you were a panelist. Let’s start at the beginning. What is democracy 2076? And are we are we working towards that?
00:04:25:08 – 00:04:28:27
David Martin
Are we trying to maintain it until,
00:04:28:31 – 00:04:43:54
Cecili Wake
Yes. Thanks for having me. Yes. Both of those. So democracy 2076 is an organization focused on building, the conditions that we need in order to have an effective, responsive and representative democracy at the 300 year mark.
00:04:43:59 – 00:04:46:00
David Martin
Much like we have now.
00:04:46:05 – 00:04:49:23
Cecili Wake
Maybe, maybe a little bit of improvement, we could we could be doing.
00:04:49:32 – 00:05:04:59
David Martin
A little improvement. And the the session that you were just at was reimagining garments. Are you looking at a whole new way to look at government? Are you looking at ways to streamline or improve it? Are we talking about wholesale changes? What’s the goals of democracy 2076?
00:05:05:02 – 00:05:26:05
Cecili Wake
Sure. So we have three primary focus areas. So the first is looking at the Constitution and really thinking about what kind of constitution, what do we need in our Constitution by 2076, in order for our democracy to continue and for it to be thriving and flourishing at that point? So that program works with state partners all across the country, national partners as well.
00:05:26:09 – 00:05:46:58
Cecili Wake
The last three years, we’ve been working with them to identify what are the changes that you would want to see in our Constitution, what amendments would be a step forward for our democracy? To identify a set that this large, broad coalition can agree on. And we’re in the early phases of implementing a strategy to bring some of those about.
00:05:47:03 – 00:05:57:28
David Martin
I am neither a historian nor constitutional law scholar, but when they wrote the Constitution, didn’t they have in mind the fact that it was a living document, that it would change?
00:05:57:36 – 00:06:24:00
Cecili Wake
Very much so. And in fact, Jefferson even said that he thought it should be written, and that it changed every 19 to 20 years of a generation, really. And we haven’t really done that. But globally, if you look at constitutions, they typically tend to last a generation before they’re amended. And if you look at the state level, that has very much been the case in the U.S. we have gotten in the last few decades into a place where we are less interested or seemingly less, able to amend the Constitution.
00:06:24:05 – 00:06:57:04
Cecili Wake
But I think the point is that Americans are not feeling, connected to their government. They don’t trust their government. They don’t feel as though the democracy that we have now is delivering for them. And what they really want is a government that is delivering for the material needs of the people. And what that looks like is a democracy that’s functioning, that has, things baked into it to make the structures work, that make Congress work, that ensure elections are fair, that provide for positive rights for folks.
00:06:57:09 – 00:07:02:31
Cecili Wake
So these are some of the sort of large buckets that we’re looking at. Right. But but the.
00:07:02:31 – 00:07:08:55
David Martin
Very word amendment Amendment, it’s just means we’re going to add. Yes, we’re going to we’re going to throw some new stuff in.
00:07:08:57 – 00:07:09:35
Cecili Wake
Exactly.
00:07:09:35 – 00:07:11:07
David Martin
And so we shouldn’t be afraid of that.
00:07:11:12 – 00:07:39:22
Cecili Wake
Exactly. It’s, it’s we’re mending it. Right. We’re but anything that lasts a long time, if you think about the Constitution as a machine, anything that lasts a long time needs to be fixed along the way. And that means if we fix it along the way, we can keep it for the long term. And I think that that’s the really the thing to remember is if we keep it up to date, if we provide the changes that are needed, given where we are in our reality in time, then it can live much longer.
00:07:39:22 – 00:07:45:15
Cecili Wake
But if we don’t make those changes and it becomes rigid, it’s much more likely to break.
00:07:45:20 – 00:07:52:01
David Martin
So we don’t need to be worried about British soldiers being forced into your home to have their house stay at your place. We could get rid of exactly.
00:07:52:01 – 00:07:54:36
Cecili Wake
Some problems are in the past. Yes.
00:07:54:41 – 00:08:01:01
David Martin
So the Constitution was set up to be changed. So all you’re doing is fulfilling the mission of Thomas Jefferson?
00:08:01:10 – 00:08:01:44
Cecili Wake
Exactly.
00:08:01:56 – 00:08:05:43
David Martin
Exactly how many people think that you’d be. Who else?
00:08:05:45 – 00:08:24:33
Cecili Wake
Well, we actually, we have a lovely and really, growing coalition of organizations at the state level. We’re represented. We’ve worked with folks in all 50 states. We have national partners who really are understanding something’s not working. And I think the real key here is that we need a positive vision for the future. We need to say this is what it could be.
00:08:24:38 – 00:08:51:33
Cecili Wake
And here’s a way of getting there. One of the other things that I think about a lot is that the majority of Americans get their, civics education from Hollywood, and that’s if you’re thinking about what they’re watching. It’s not necessarily telling a story of effective government. It’s not telling a story of positive futures. One of our programs is specifically looking at that question and really trying to understand what are people seeing, and how does it make sense?
00:08:51:34 – 00:09:05:12
Cecili Wake
Think about democracy. Do they feel a sense of agency in it when they see those things? And what can we do to help produce more stories that are pro topia and that are that are showing a positive but not utopian future, a realistic, positive future?
00:09:05:14 – 00:09:20:32
David Martin
I just rewatched about a half an hour’s worth of All The President’s Men with Robert Redford in a little retrospective. So that’s okay, right? Yes. Yes, please. That’s a good place. All right. Is there a movie that you’ve seen? I mean, you brought this up where you’re like, oh, this is a good this is a good movie to watch.
00:09:20:37 – 00:09:26:35
Cecili Wake
You know, that’s an interesting question. I think personally, no, I’m sure they might be out there, but but that’s the challenge, right?
00:09:26:36 – 00:09:28:42
David Martin
Is Michael Douglas an American president comes to mind?
00:09:28:42 – 00:09:37:51
Cecili Wake
Yeah, sure. And you know, West Wing I think gives us a sense of, you know, here’s here’s a working a functioning democracy, a functioning government. Interestingly, though.
00:09:37:56 – 00:09:38:59
David Martin
So there are positives.
00:09:39:03 – 00:09:57:32
Cecili Wake
There are some positive things. But interestingly, West Wing, for example, is not doesn’t encourage folks to get involved because they see it and they think, oh, it could work like it’s working. It’s fine. They don’t need me. So what we’re looking for is that balance of information, or content that helps people understand, democracies in trouble.
00:09:57:32 – 00:10:00:32
Cecili Wake
Democracy is worth saving, and you can play a role in saving it.
00:10:00:37 – 00:10:03:57
David Martin
You said there were three things that we got stuck with. Oh, you said, what are the other. What?
00:10:04:02 – 00:10:26:06
Cecili Wake
You. Okay, so the second one was the imagining work, which is our work with Hollywood, that I was just talking about. And then the third one is called pro-democracy political coalitions. And that work is focused on understanding political realignments. So the ways in which political parties realign around their ideologies over time, typically that takes that happens every 30 or so years.
00:10:26:11 – 00:10:39:44
Cecili Wake
So if you look back, you’ll see, new Deal changes. You’ll see, Reagan era changes that have changed the makeup of who, who’s in them, what they believe in. You know, what they stand for.
00:10:39:44 – 00:10:45:27
David Martin
Well, in my lifetime, you know, the the Solid South was Democrat, and now the Solid South is Republican.
00:10:45:27 – 00:10:50:20
Cecili Wake
Exactly, exactly. So those realignments happen. Yeah, that’s an inevitability.
00:10:50:26 – 00:10:52:25
David Martin
Teddy Roosevelt would not be a Republican today.
00:10:52:26 – 00:11:14:05
Cecili Wake
Exactly. Yeah. So what we’re looking at through that program, and we have a report actually coming out later this week that’s focused on what might the future realignments look like. What are some scenarios of the future where, you know, we have five seniors. One is both political parties, a pro-democracy. We have one where both political parties are leaning authoritarian.
00:11:14:10 – 00:11:34:41
Cecili Wake
We have one where the left is leaning authoritarian and the right is for democracy and vice versa. So we’re really trying to understand what are the different ways in which we could be moving forward, and how can we intervene to ensure that we’re on a path to pro-democracy futures, that any political party that’s viable in 2050, 2076 is committed to democracy?
00:11:34:45 – 00:11:56:47
Cecili Wake
So that work looks at what are the issues that are starting to divide people. So, you know, what are the things that are sort of outside of the left right binary that we currently see that in the future might emerge as the things that divide us and how by understanding some of those things, can we look for opportunities to again nudge in the direction of democracy in the.
00:11:56:47 – 00:12:13:04
David Martin
US of a we’ve gotten basically into a two party system, Democratic Party and Republican Party. Other nations don’t have that. They have multiple parties Green Party, labor Party, Conservative Party, Christian National Party. You ever see America switching from strictly a two party system?
00:12:13:14 – 00:12:18:27
Cecili Wake
I think anything’s possible. So I don’t I don’t I won’t say yes or no. I think I.
00:12:18:27 – 00:12:19:05
David Martin
Would say yes.
00:12:19:14 – 00:12:23:24
Cecili Wake
I think we’re in a moment of great upheaval in the country.
00:12:23:26 – 00:12:27:55
David Martin
I mean, the independent people registering independent is the largest segment of voters.
00:12:27:55 – 00:12:47:22
Cecili Wake
And and the reason for that, I think, is there is no such thing as a moderate. What you really have are people who align with the party all the way down the road on every issue. Yep. Or you have people who align with one party on some issues and with the other party on other issues, but very few people are in the middle of any issue.
00:12:47:28 – 00:13:09:41
Cecili Wake
Most people have an opinion. Yeah, right. Or yes or no on most, most issues. So I think where we’re seeing where independence grow is a sign that we’re realigning. Right. It’s saying there are fewer and fewer people who agree all the way down with every issue on one side or the other. And so that’s going to have to be taken into consideration as our political system evolves over the next 30 years.
00:13:09:46 – 00:13:21:56
David Martin
I looked a little bit about, you know, democracy 2076 before we spoke. And I saw something that I wanted to talk about, which I thought was awesome. On your on your website, democracy is nonpartisan.
00:13:22:01 – 00:13:22:36
Cecili Wake
Yes.
00:13:22:41 – 00:13:23:39
David Martin
Doesn’t feel that way.
00:13:23:40 – 00:13:26:42
Cecili Wake
Does it? Doesn’t. But but shouldn’t it should.
00:13:26:49 – 00:13:28:08
David Martin
Feel that way. Yes, absolutely.
00:13:28:22 – 00:13:43:40
Cecili Wake
I think here’s the thing. If we want to have a democracy, we have to do democracy. And what that means is we have to be able to disagree with each other and still come to the table and identify solutions together. And, you know, that’s why we vote.
00:13:43:45 – 00:13:46:23
David Martin
And we recording this in November in the middle of a government shutdown.
00:13:46:34 – 00:13:50:47
Cecili Wake
Exactly. On Election Day. Right. And, you know, we’re looking at that.
00:13:50:47 – 00:13:52:25
David Martin
Can’t be good for democracy.
00:13:52:30 – 00:14:24:09
Cecili Wake
Well, right. It probably can’t be right. But but we have to start thinking of democracy as something that we all have a responsibility to build. Right? And that means that when we are fighting for our democracy, that we’re doing it in a nonpartisan way. And I think that, you know, some of our greatest allies in this work are, across the aisle like every possible ideology coming to the table other than those who oppose democracy, which is to say, you have people on the left, you have people on the right, you have people down the middle who support the idea of democracy.
00:14:24:14 – 00:14:34:08
Cecili Wake
It’s not a Partizan issue. Despite the shouldn’t that our current in our current environment is trying to brand it as a Partizan issue? It really should not be.
00:14:34:22 – 00:14:36:00
David Martin
Does that make you nervous?
00:14:36:05 – 00:15:01:35
Cecili Wake
Oh yeah, absolutely. I mean, I think as a you know, I grew up overseas, I’ve seen authoritarianism, I have seen, political violence, I’ve seen all kinds of situations that we don’t want to find ourselves in. And I think one of the challenges that we experience is that most Americans take the status quo for granted. So we look at the way things have been and assume that they will continue to be that way.
00:15:01:35 – 00:15:08:59
Cecili Wake
And, sometimes it can take a little while for people to realize that they are no longer that way or that things are shifting very quickly, which is, I think, where we are now.
00:15:09:03 – 00:15:10:37
David Martin
Okay. Could you be hopeful now?
00:15:10:41 – 00:15:14:54
Cecili Wake
Yes, I was hopeful. Absolutely. I will say really honestly.
00:15:14:59 – 00:15:25:23
David Martin
No, let’s, let’s, you know, democracy 2076, you have you have a vision for for 50 years from now. Give us a reason to be households that we are not sliding towards. Yeah. You know.
00:15:25:28 – 00:15:50:08
Cecili Wake
So one of the most wonderful things about working in an organization that looks at the long term is that you can very, you know, as you zoom out, you take yourself out of the current crises and you start to look at the broader arc, the broader trends. And we are in, as humans, a broader trend towards more democratic governance, towards more shared governance, towards more you know, individual.
00:15:50:08 – 00:15:51:36
David Martin
Around the world you’re talking about.
00:15:51:36 – 00:16:13:05
Cecili Wake
Right? Yeah, absolutely. And right now might not feel that way. Right now is one of those moments of of upheaval. But if you zoom out and you look at what’s available for our future, what are the possibilities for a future? I think that’s where the hope really comes in. And the other thing that I’ll say that I’ve been really hopeful about is every time I have this conversation with folks, they get excited.
00:16:13:20 – 00:16:20:15
Cecili Wake
People are excited about thinking about democracy, thinking about the long term of of our country and what 2076 might look like.
00:16:20:15 – 00:16:25:21
David Martin
Well, I hope everybody who’s listening does. And if they do, how can they help? How can people help?
00:16:25:26 – 00:16:54:22
Cecili Wake
Yeah, absolutely. So I have lots of ideas on this. I think the first thing is to talk to people about the future of democracy. Look at democracy is nonpartisan. Remember that democracy, we can’t have it if we don’t do it. And engage with your neighbors, engage with your community. Talk to people about how important democracy is to you, and make it really clear that it’s not Partizan, that you want to stand shoulder to shoulder with people who believe in democracy, regardless of what other stuff they disagree with you on.
00:16:54:27 – 00:17:13:34
Cecili Wake
So I think that’s the first thing is, is really just to, to make that clear in your, you know, daily existence so you doesn’t have to be going out to protest sometimes that’s useful, but it’s really about having those conversations. And then in addition to that, check out our website, democracy 2070 6.org. We’ve got a report coming out later this week.
00:17:13:34 – 00:17:22:02
Cecili Wake
We have all kinds of information about our Constitution work and our imagining work, looking at Hollywood, and more coming soon.
00:17:22:07 – 00:17:24:17
David Martin
How does this translate to good governance?
00:17:24:21 – 00:17:47:16
Cecili Wake
Right. So I think this is really about understanding that government also needs to be thinking for the long term. So if we are really approaching the ways in which we are governing with an eye toward 50 years out, we thinking about those future generations, we’re going to do governance differently. And what that might mean is we’re going to be better at anticipating upcoming and emerging challenges.
00:17:47:21 – 00:18:07:27
Cecili Wake
We’re going to be better at developing nimble and adaptable systems so that when challenges arise that we weren’t able to anticipate, we can still sail through them without it undermining the structure and the integrity of, of the government. It means that we are able to actually build systems that can last. So I think when you look.
00:18:07:27 – 00:18:11:43
David Martin
At that’s going to be hard to get elected leaders to do that because they’re looking at today.
00:18:11:48 – 00:18:27:46
Cecili Wake
They are looking at today, but they’re also looking at how can we get people excited to come out and get me in office today? And the way to get people excited is to talk about a big, bold vision. And we’ve seen this throughout history. I mean, I think if you think about our original founders, that this was what they were all about.
00:18:27:46 – 00:18:37:16
Cecili Wake
Right. Sure. Thinking about the long term, thinking about what they could do at that moment to prepare for future generations. We should be doing the same thing. And I just saw that happening.
00:18:37:19 – 00:18:41:46
David Martin
And the governor’s mansions in Congress and, mayor’s office.
00:18:41:48 – 00:19:00:25
Cecili Wake
It is starting to happen. I think it is definitely starting to happen. We have seen one at the local level and at the state level. A lot more thinking along these lines. The UN declaration for Future Generations is a document that really outlines. Here are some commitments and methodologies we can use to incorporate long term thinking into governance.
00:19:00:37 – 00:19:17:46
Cecili Wake
And we’re seeing that globally, but also starting to see that emerge in local government. I was just in a session here at the conference. I mentioned the Universal Declaration of, I mean, the declaration for future generations. And everybody in the room already knew what it was, which is such a great sign, right, that we’re thinking in that way.
00:19:17:57 – 00:19:32:26
Cecili Wake
So I do think it’s happening. I think also what we’re seeing is more and more political leaders, government, elected, not administrators, but electives, realizing that they need to step up and be bold if they are going to continue having a job.
00:19:32:31 – 00:19:53:05
David Martin
I would imagine that there’s lots of people in, you know, federal departments, so, you know, undersecretaries, probably people in the governor’s office are working on this and thinking about it and talking about and interacting about it. How does that translate to the elected people to get them on board with, you know, future, future thinking? Because that’s the challenge, right?
00:19:53:06 – 00:20:35:53
Cecili Wake
Absolutely. It’s a great question. And I think also probably one of the, the, the bigger speed bumps that we’ve experienced in the history of the country has been the shifting tides and the ways in which a nonpartisan administration of, you know, the public administration folks have to kind of roll with changes coming from the politicos. I think this emphasis, though, on a future vision, this emphasis on what we can do for sustainability for the long term, both of those things help to level the playing field to a certain extent, which is to say, if you ask most people, what do you want to see in the future?
00:20:35:57 – 00:20:41:25
Cecili Wake
We’re much more likely to agree on that than we are to agree on what policy should we pass today? Yes.
00:20:41:25 – 00:20:50:19
David Martin
And so everybody wants clean water. Everybody wants a street. They want what’s good for. Everybody wants health care. Everybody wants the planes to land on time safely.
00:20:50:19 – 00:21:08:34
Cecili Wake
Exactly. They have disagreements with them. All those things happen. Yeah, that’s what they want, right. So when you start from that and then work backwards, you’ve already started from a place of building alignment rather than starting from a place of contention. And then trying to build alignment as you go. Not so hard. Yeah.
00:21:08:39 – 00:21:31:32
David Martin
What you’re really talking about, it sounds like, is changing the thinking completely in government from, you know, like, let’s fix this problem today. It’s like, no, no, no, no. Yeah, I understand you want to fix the road, but you really have to worry about what’s going to happen 50 years from now. That should be worry number one. So if you don’t, we’re not going to be a democracy in 2076.
00:21:31:37 – 00:21:46:02
Cecili Wake
I think that’s I think that’s absolutely part of it. I think I don’t want to say we shouldn’t be thinking about these emergent and really critical issues that we’re experiencing today. Right? So if you’re living in a neighborhood that the streets are full of potholes, that’s affecting your daily life in a really meaningful way.
00:21:46:07 – 00:21:46:27
David Martin
Sure.
00:21:46:41 – 00:22:04:09
Cecili Wake
We don’t want to say like, no, you shouldn’t worry about that because of this other thing. Like, people aren’t experiencing this other thing, right? So we have to do both. But I think it’s really about saying, let’s do both. Let’s do the now stuff in service of a shared vision of the future. Let’s fix the roads in a way that’s more sustainable.
00:22:04:24 – 00:22:21:20
Cecili Wake
Let’s be thinking about what you know, where there might be new roads in the future or what new technologies may emerge. Let’s think about what’s going to be the flow of traffic as we’re moving forward. I’m not a city planner, so I’m making all that up. But yeah, you understand my point, which is we can do things today in a way that is in service.
00:22:21:20 – 00:22:23:53
Cecili Wake
And that’s thinking not only of today but also of tomorrow.
00:22:23:54 – 00:22:33:59
David Martin
When you have these conversations with elected officials, our people in government and, you know, you sort of me, I don’t wake them up, perhaps to this what’s the reaction?
00:22:34:04 – 00:22:55:12
Cecili Wake
I mean, we have seen so much excitement. So in talking with, members offices, with their staffs, with, with other national organizations across the political spectrum, there’s a lot of excitement. I think there’s this feeling of, this is a this is a moment this we’re living in history, right? We’re living in something that people are going to be reading about later.
00:22:55:17 – 00:23:17:52
Cecili Wake
And I think that there’s, there’s a freedom within that to be able to think about what that means for 50 years from now, and really to be able to put yourself in that kind of mindset can be really helpful in this moment. But also it’s exciting and it feels like there’s a really positive thing that we can do with this moment of opportunity.
00:23:17:57 – 00:23:20:17
Cecili Wake
Rather than just be wallowing in despair.
00:23:20:20 – 00:23:41:30
David Martin
We’re going to get your philosophy on government, and that’s going to come up next. Topics. The Good Government Show is sponsored by our that’s oh, you are for our community. Get involved. We hear that all the time from government leaders. Our co-branded with your governments name and logo. Your staff and the people you serve are connected and part of your community.
00:23:41:44 – 00:24:08:01
David Martin
From any device. Your members provide reliable data and meaningful feedback. Ask a question like, do we want more parkland or better homeless services? More engage conversations come through the our app. Visit our co that’s ou rco.com and book a demonstration. After you get done with this episode, hear more good government stories with our friends at How to Really Run a City for mayors.
00:24:08:01 – 00:24:38:00
David Martin
Kasim Reed of Atlanta and Michael Nutter of Philadelphia, and their co-host, journalist and author Larry Platt, talk with guests and other mayors about how to really get stuff done in cities around the nation. Check them out where you’re listening now or through their nonprofit news site, The Philadelphia Citizen. Dot org slash podcasts. I want to ask you a series of questions to get to the heart of what your real thinking is about government and about, you know, your role in government.
00:24:38:10 – 00:24:48:33
David Martin
So, many of these questions are the things that I ask people like city mayor. So a little a little appropriate, a little different. But let’s start at the top. What is good government? Define it.
00:24:48:38 – 00:25:06:12
Cecili Wake
For me, good government is is one that listens and interacts with the people. So we have a government that is responsive, that is representative and that is effective, that is able to do the things that are needed to be done in a way that is responsive to the desires and needs of the people.
00:25:06:21 – 00:25:10:10
David Martin
If people don’t like what they’re seeing, what should they do and how can they make a change?
00:25:10:14 – 00:25:28:46
Cecili Wake
So there are lots of different ways to do that. I think the number one way is to be in communication with your electeds, you know, making sure that they know the things that are concerns to you and why and what you would like to see. And that goes from the local community level all the way up to the national level.
00:25:28:46 – 00:25:44:46
Cecili Wake
I think very often folks will sort of pick one, and that’s where they focus. And really it’s about accountability of our electeds across all of those levels. And then the second thing is find other folks that that share your viewpoint or that also care about the things you care about. They don’t have to share your view point, right?
00:25:44:46 – 00:25:52:59
Cecili Wake
So if you’re talking about your community, find other folks in your community who are, you know, who of that community and want to see it flourish, build relationships there.
00:25:53:08 – 00:25:55:23
David Martin
Even if it’s just, you know, they want to build a new park.
00:25:55:28 – 00:26:14:59
Cecili Wake
Sure. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I think that’s the thing is that’s what governance is about, right? Government is meant to be providing for the things that the people need want and to be representative of who those people are and responsive to their needs. So if that’s what we’re, you know, trying to build and yes, a local park is is a really important place.
00:26:14:59 – 00:26:34:45
Cecili Wake
I live in a in a little town and we you know, certainly the how many trees we have in the, in the canopy is a constant issue of discussion in our town, as is democracy. And I think that that’s right. Having that mixture where you’re talking about both these sort of larger long term existential issues and frankly, the conversation about trees is also long term.
00:26:34:56 – 00:26:41:13
Cecili Wake
The conversation about the park is also long term. That’s where are these, you know, where’s our community going to gather in the future? Things like that.
00:26:41:17 – 00:26:43:34
David Martin
Who inspires you? What inspires.
00:26:43:36 – 00:26:53:32
Cecili Wake
Ou? Well, so I have two children and I think for sure that I get a huge amount of inspiration from them. I have two daughters, and,
00:26:53:36 – 00:26:53:58
David Martin
How old?
00:26:54:11 – 00:26:55:28
Cecili Wake
21 and 15.
00:26:55:30 – 00:26:56:14
David Martin
Okay.
00:26:56:18 – 00:27:24:21
Cecili Wake
And, they have, you know, my 21 year old was born in 2004, so she’s never been in a in America that was not at war. Well, and yet it has been asked to make very little sacrifice in service of an America at war. And I think it’s really just sort of interesting thing to, to bear in mind for this generation, now that they’ve lived through all of this conflict, they’ve lived through, you know, all of this, upheaval in the world.
00:27:24:21 – 00:27:47:15
Cecili Wake
And yet their and situation has been relatively unscathed by those parts. At the same time, they’re growing up with massive amounts of existential dread around climate change, around, you know, are we going to have a democracy in the future? And so their their status quo is different than anything that we’ve ever seen. And then you have also the Covid factor.
00:27:47:15 – 00:27:55:41
Cecili Wake
So both of my kids were, in lockdown, you know, doing online school. And it’s it had a toll, you know, that took a toll on this generation.
00:27:55:46 – 00:27:58:49
David Martin
It was my daughters, I think sophomore and junior years. Yeah.
00:27:58:54 – 00:28:16:06
Cecili Wake
So we I think we’re going to see that, that they have a very unique and different perspective on solutions, on governance, on what the future should look like. And I’m really excited to listen to them and, and follow some orders from that group, from that generation, because I think they’ve they’ve got their heads on straight.
00:28:16:20 – 00:28:18:15
David Martin
Are they headed towards public service or.
00:28:18:16 – 00:28:25:21
Cecili Wake
We’ll see. I have my my eldest is studying ethics philosophy and and justice law and society. So she’s she’s.
00:28:25:21 – 00:28:25:39
David Martin
Had this.
00:28:25:51 – 00:28:28:52
Cecili Wake
Reaction far too far from the tree. Right.
00:28:28:57 – 00:28:30:25
David Martin
The other two early.
00:28:30:30 – 00:28:37:08
Cecili Wake
Thank you. Yeah. To her. She’s she’s an incredible artist and writer. So I think that she will be using those gifts.
00:28:37:13 – 00:28:45:55
David Martin
Did you see yourself? I mean, you you said your parents were in the Foreign Service when you grew up and grew up overseas. Did you see yourself getting into this line of work?
00:28:46:00 – 00:29:09:04
Cecili Wake
Yeah, yes, I definitely did. So, yeah, I grew up in this sort of strange situation of being, a representative of the U.S in countries where the U.S. had not necessarily fulfilled the, mythos of the U.S. and I was told that on a regular basis by my friends, by the people that I interacted with in.
00:29:09:10 – 00:29:10:20
David Martin
Oh, you’re.
00:29:10:25 – 00:29:31:41
Cecili Wake
Constantly being reminded the ways in which our policies were hypocritical to our art. You know what we said we were, and for me, that was really transformative and really, you know, made me understand how important that mythos is and how important it is that we continue to try to live up to it and to get closer and closer and closer.
00:29:31:46 – 00:29:59:37
Cecili Wake
Because it’s not only for this country, it’s globally. When you think about human rights activists in Syria, one of the reasons that they have the ability to do the work that they do is because there’s this feeling that out there, there is a functioning, really powerful democracy. And without that, all of those other folks who are struggling on the ground to build those things, you know, get left without that beacon.
00:29:59:42 – 00:30:00:28
David Martin
So you need hope.
00:30:00:39 – 00:30:02:14
Cecili Wake
See, hope not to have.
00:30:02:14 – 00:30:11:34
David Martin
Hope that the and that is the hope and promise of America. Right. Exactly. That’s what every, you know, guy on a, on a, on a ship in 1900 was thinking. Right.
00:30:11:35 – 00:30:12:06
Cecili Wake
Exactly.
00:30:12:06 – 00:30:12:44
David Martin
And today.
00:30:12:49 – 00:30:22:56
Cecili Wake
Exactly. It’s about it’s about hope. And opportunity. It’s not about building an idealistic future. It’s about building a positive future. And we can do that.
00:30:23:01 – 00:30:31:02
David Martin
While you don’t work in government, you certainly work with government, and you’re certainly thinking about government. What would you like people to know about government that they probably don’t know?
00:30:31:04 – 00:30:32:20
Cecili Wake
00:30:32:25 – 00:30:33:18
David Martin
See, I told them these are.
00:30:33:23 – 00:30:55:38
Cecili Wake
Yeah. This is a hard question. I think I think the first thing I would like people to know is that most people working in government are incredibly committed to the constituents, to the people that they serve. They’re incredibly committed to effective government, to responsive government. They they really want to be doing a good job. That’s why they’re in those roles, and that the majority of them are nonpartisan.
00:30:55:42 – 00:31:15:28
Cecili Wake
And I think that’s really hard for us now in the way that that, you know, polarization has taken over for us to remember that most people who are in public service are not approach that work from a nonpartizan perspective. And I think that’s critical, right? Because it’s about serving everybody, not just one segment of the population.
00:31:15:33 – 00:31:19:16
David Martin
What’s the best part about working through democracy 2076?
00:31:19:21 – 00:31:39:17
Cecili Wake
I think the best part is that even in times of great, upheaval in times of great challenge, as we’re experiencing right now, there’s a wellspring of hope and a wellspring of opportunity to seize on that hope and do tangible work in service of it. And then the second best part is that the team is incredible to work with.
00:31:39:17 – 00:31:52:48
Cecili Wake
Just really smart, really effective people. Not just in our organization, but the partners that we collaborate with are also amazing. So it’s another source of hope is just to see how many people are out here doing really important work.
00:31:52:57 – 00:31:59:29
David Martin
How do you keep from getting depressed, frustrated, annoyed, furious when you see the headlines?
00:31:59:29 – 00:32:14:02
Cecili Wake
What says I keep from any of this? So I think first off, yes, all of those things are going to happen. Yeah, we’re going to we’re going to have those feelings because how could you not? This is, you know, if you’re if you’re paying attention at any point in history, you’re going to see things that are going to be upsetting.
00:32:14:06 – 00:32:34:32
Cecili Wake
So first off is to not deny that that that exists. I think second is to get in touch with the things that affect around you. So for me, it’s, you know, it’s my family. It’s going outside and and experiencing this world. It’s taking a now sometimes suffering, sometimes that’s just it’s.
00:32:34:36 – 00:32:35:38
David Martin
Just setting it all off.
00:32:35:41 – 00:32:36:15
Cecili Wake
Exactly.
00:32:36:15 – 00:32:37:33
David Martin
What do you do for fun?
00:32:37:38 – 00:32:40:22
Cecili Wake
Oof! All those things I just said. Okay.
00:32:40:27 – 00:32:41:36
David Martin
Take it off.
00:32:41:41 – 00:32:53:07
Cecili Wake
Yeah. So I’m an avid reader, so I, I find myself reading, I love gardening, and, I call my my garden the Democracy Garden because I listen to books about democracy while I’m gardening. And,
00:32:53:11 – 00:32:56:42
David Martin
You kind of take yourself out of the purpose target, which is to which.
00:32:56:42 – 00:32:58:35
Cecili Wake
Is to clear my mind, but I think that it’s.
00:32:58:35 – 00:33:02:01
David Martin
Actually necessary. You’re listening to a podcast? Yes.
00:33:02:05 – 00:33:18:42
Cecili Wake
And I think it’s an excellent actual you know, it’s a way of, it’s a great metaphor. Gardening is is an excellent metaphor for what we’re trying to do here. Right? Is that we’re trying to sow the seeds. We might not see the flowers bloom, but we’re trying to sow the seeds of democracy for next season.
00:33:18:47 – 00:33:33:04
David Martin
This is a good government show. We always try to bring it back to a good government. Tell me about something that you feel like you’ve had an impact on through democracy 2076 that you’re you’re excited about. So, you know, that’s a big project for a small project.
00:33:33:08 – 00:34:03:36
Cecili Wake
Yeah, absolutely. Wow. So many to choose from. I’m going to start with our Constitution work. We’ve had three national convenings of partners. And I think the thing that I have been the most excited about to see there is just the degree to which folks can come together into a room with people who have different politics than they do, and talk about the future of our Constitution and find alignment and then go back to their communities, go back to their organizations, and push that forward together.
00:34:03:41 – 00:34:27:10
Cecili Wake
So to me, that’s that’s a huge win. And the opportunity for our organization to continue pushing that, that agenda and to be partnering with all of these organizations, helping them with capacity building, helping them connect to this funding for that work. That’s that’s a huge, huge step forward. And because I’m concerned for our democracy. And then I think the second one, there’s one of these projects.
00:34:27:10 – 00:34:49:16
Cecili Wake
So our imagining work, we put out a, a report where we have another one coming in in the new year. Really looking at like, what is the impact of this content? But the best part is that then we were able to go and meet with creatives and really understand from their perspective, why is it, you know, what are the challenges, what are the what are the roadblocks to doing this kind of work?
00:34:49:16 – 00:35:21:52
Cecili Wake
And how can how can we develop tools and resources and support? I think we’re going to be seeing some very exciting stuff coming out of Hollywood over the coming years that that helps us reinforce our our commitment to democracy as a country and on our political coalitions work. I am so excited that we have this report coming out this week, because I think it’s a chance for folks to really think differently about how we view political parties, how we view the ways in which we we see eye to eye or not with one another, and where we actually fall on the spectrum of issues that that are totally outside of the right left binary.
00:35:22:05 – 00:35:31:05
David Martin
So we’ll have a link once the show comes out, to that report. But where can people find it? Because it will be at the time this show airs. It will be it will have been out.
00:35:31:10 – 00:35:41:41
Cecili Wake
Democracy 2070 6.org. And you can go to programs and click on political coalitions to see that one. But for all of our programs there’s great content on those pages okay.
00:35:41:46 – 00:35:59:02
David Martin
All right. Check it out. Cecily wake, you’re the deputy director of democracy 2076. And the idea is to keep your eye on the prize 50 years from now, 300 years of America, to make sure we’re still a vibrant beacon of democracy for the world. Yes, that is it. That’s all.
00:35:59:02 – 00:35:59:29
Cecili Wake
You can do it.
00:35:59:40 – 00:36:09:37
David Martin
And, you just wrapped up a conference session called Reimagining Government. And I think we talked a little bit about the ways that government can be reimagined. Thank you. Pleasure to have you on. A pleasure to meet you.
00:36:09:39 – 00:36:11:52
Cecili Wake
Thank you so much. It was wonderful to talk with you.
00:36:12:01 – 00:36:32:37
David Martin
Thanks. I want to hear more about good government. Check out another show I host Leading Iowa Good Government in Iowa’s Cities. I host the show with Brad Cavanaugh, mayor of Dubuque, Iowa, and the immediate past president of the Iowa League of Cities. Together, we talk to leaders in Iowa cities. We talk about what works and what good government looks like in Iowa.
00:36:32:41 – 00:36:41:05
David Martin
Joining us right here. We listening now that’s leading Iowa. Good government in Iowa. Cities.
00:36:41:10 – 00:37:02:32
David Martin
Anything that lasts a long time needs to be fixed along the way. When you think about it that way you see the Constitution and our democracy can’t just sit still. It must be amended, changed, updated. That, says Cecily Wake of Democracy 2076, is the best way to keep our democracy going strong and responsive and working our time. Democracy is nonpartisan.
00:37:02:43 – 00:37:19:34
David Martin
It’s not left versus right. It’s an issue everyone can agree on. To get it, we need to come together to talk about it and work together. That’s what Cecily Wake says. She says it will make our democracy stronger and still working for all of us. So check out the things democracy 2076 is doing. We have a link on our show notes.
00:37:19:46 – 00:37:34:44
David Martin
It’s good to know there are people out there thinking about the future for all of us. Well, that’s our show. Thanks for listening. Please like us and share this with your friends and viewers right here where you’re listening, and check out our website. Good Government show.com for extras. Help us keep telling stories of good government and action everywhere.
00:37:34:49 – 00:37:47:01
David Martin
Join us again for another episode right here. I’m Dave Martin and this is the Good Government show.
00:37:47:06 – 00:38:08:43
David Martin
The Good Government show is a Valley Park production. Jim Munro, Dave Martin, that’s me and David Snyder are the executive producers. Our show is edited and produced by Jason Sterling. Please subscribe then share and like us and reviews. That’s the best way to make sure we’re able to keep telling these stories of our government working for all of us.
00:38:08:57 – 00:38:24:06
David Martin
Then listen to the next episode of The Good Government Show.
00:38:24:11 – 00:38:26:51
Narrator
This podcast is part of the democracy Group.
**This transcription was created using digital tools and has not been edited by a live person. We apologize for any discrepancies or errors.